[sazbaztaz]

Hi I hope this is the right category to post this question to...

I purchased my Astra J about 3 months ago and since then I had couple of minor issues like airbag light but nothing serious so I got an OBD tool "XTool D7" because I thaught it would come handy anytime in the future and I have to get a spare key for my car anyway...

So from what I heard this tool is an AMAXING tool for the money and it does lot more than a DIY-er would ever need including key programming.

So I got a blank flip-key from Ebay (fits astra J, H etc 433Mhx etc...)...

I thaught, before I cut it phisically at the locksmiths I take my original key apart and put the BLADE only from my old key in my new key from ebay and start the programming that way so if I don't succeed with the programming I would not throw out money for the cutting.

Good thing I did because I just cannot program the new key 😀

I do everything like the software is saying but the immobilizer comes on at the end. Old key works, the new does not.

So I sit in the car, close the doors, run the software, select key programming, select immobiliser, select key programming, select program keys WITHOUT SMART, enther the four digit pin that was read before by the software and it's accepted, turn the ignition on, wait for 10 minutes, open-close doors etc... please don't mind the order might be slight different I just cant remember.

So anyway, at the end... nothing. The key does NOT work. Immobliliser comes on when I turn the ignition on.

Now, if anyone has experience with this might know what I'm about to ask and might sound obvious to some...

When you program a key does it have to be a "blank" key (blank chip) or any vauxhall J key can be programmed?

The reason I'm asking this is to narrow down the circle of what the problem might be.

Is it possible that somehow the new key is already programmed and that's the reason I cannot program the key?

I also have an option of "All Keys Lost" in my XTool D7 but I do not want to go with that in case my old key get's erased and I can't "bring it back".

I would apprecitate any help.

 

[valer]

I don't use that tool so have no experience of it but it sounds as though it's either the tool isn't capable
or the key (Chinese copy perhaps ?) has a faulty immo chip.
The usual procedure for these keys is that it takes 10 mins to countdown during which time it erases all keys from the system,it then takes you through a learning process one key at a time (new or old) with a ignition on/off and the open/shut doors as you proceed.
The keys need to be either virgin or have been previously programmed to the car to use successfully.

 

[sazbaztaz]

I don't use that tool so have no experience of it but it sounds as though it's either the tool isn't capable
or the key (Chinese copy perhaps ?)...

Thanks for the reply valer.

Yes, this is a chineese copy from Ebay £8.50 (also sells on Amazon)...

2 Button Flip Remote Key Fob 433MHz ID46 Chip for Opel Vauxhall Insignia Astra | eBay

Transponder Chip Yes ID46. Chip: ID46. Hertz 433Mhz. Hertz: 433mhz. Fit For For Opel Vauxhall Insignia Astra Zafira Mokka Corsa. Vauxhall Astra J 2009- 2014(Valeo types). Vauxhall Insignia 2009 – 2014.

www.ebay.co.uk

I know about the 10 mins and first I was wondering why exactly 10 mins because that makes no sense for erasing data etc...

Well, my logic tell me it's because if I were a thief I would have to wait and sit in the car for 10 mins which would not be easy... It's jut how Vauxhall programmed the software in my optionion.

Anyway, yes the pin is excepted because if I enter anything else the sofware stalls for about 3-4 mins and pops up with a failure...

After that ignition on off etc and the 10 min wait time...

But at the end nothing. The key does not work.

So in a nutshell, used keys from other astra J cars cannot be re-programmed to another car correct? (I have a used key from my old Astra H...)

And, it might be that the chip in my new key from Ebay is faulty in the first place?

I guess I just have to get another one from another seller and see...

I just wonder how often does it happen that the chip is faulty (one out of 200 or so...)?

 

[valer]

I know about the 10 mins and first I was wondering why exactly 10 mins because that makes no sense for erasing data etc...

When this programming procedure was introduced i was working at a dealer,
we figured it was so the cost of programming would go up to cover the technicians extra time lol

So in a nutshell, used keys from other astra J cars cannot be re-programmed to another car correct? (I have a used key from my old Astra H...)

It's possible to get old genuine keys re-set to virgin nowadays,saying that an Astra H key wouldn't work on a J regardless

And, it might be that the chip in my new key from Ebay is faulty in the first place?

It may well be,always difficult to pin down when you you get a duff key,
i would try a different programmer (like opcom) but not easy if you don't already have one to hand

I guess I just have to get another one from another seller and see...
I just wonder how often does it happen that the chip is faulty (one out of 200 or so...)?

I used to supply and program a lot of Vx keys,i did try the Chinese copies but found the failure rate to be about 50%
they are supposed to be better now,but i retired from this a few years ago so i've no proof.

 

[sazbaztaz]

Is it possible to get old genuine keys re-set to virgin nowadays,saying that an Astra H key wouldn't work on a J regardless

Hmmm that's funny then because when I change the vehicle type to Astra H 1.6 Petrol Hatchback on ebay for the same product it says "This fits your vehicle".

Anyway, about "old genuine keys re-set to virgin"... Is that something one would do separately with a function like "Erase key" or "Reset key" that Opcom or some other dedicated tool has as an inbuilt function or this is done "on the fly" by going trough the regular procedure like programming a new key and it's done automatically?

The reason I ask this is IF the Astra H key CAN be programmed to an Astra J AND it's done by the software on the fly automatically I could rule out the possiblilty of my tool not working properly because I have tried programming my old Astra H to my Astra J car and that did not work either.

So if you're sure Astra H car keys will not work with Astra J anyway I still have the possibility of having a duff key from Ebay.

My problem is there are too many variables and I have to rule out a few to narrow down on the actual problem.

I used to supply and program a lot of Vx keys,i did try the Chinese copies but found the failure rate to be about 50%

That's a lot but you're making a pont there if it was years ago that could have well improved by the time...

Anyway you already helped me a lot Valer and having said what I did above I will still go for another key anyway (variables here or there...) and post my results once the key arrives.

 

[valer]

I can only advise from my experience,certainly original H keys even if re-set will not work on a J,
now if the Chinese have made a universal key then it may well work with different cars.
The re-setting was only done with specialised equipment and i believe that still applies today

 

[sazbaztaz]

I can only advise from my experience,certainly original H keys even if re-set will not work on a J,
now if the Chinese have made a universal key then it may well work with different cars.
The re-setting was only done with specialised equipment and i believe that still applies today

I will keep updated...

 

[pat100]

It’s not much help and I have absolutely no details, but my local key shop guy was tearing his hair over why he couldn’t program my Chinese key. He contacted the tool's software supplier by email and they gave him an updated sequence to follow which worked. (I think you know that once you have sorted it out, you need to reprogram all your keys in one go)

 

[pat100]

P.S. I bought a key blade ready cut from a photo online as a few locksmiths said they couldn’t cut it.

 

[sazbaztaz]

It’s not much help and I have absolutely no details, but my local key shop guy was tearing his hair over why he couldn’t program my Chinese key. He contacted the tool's software supplier by email and they gave him an updated sequence to follow which worked. (I think you know that once you have sorted it out, you need to reprogram all your keys in one go)

Thanks for the info really helpful. I already contacted the seller asking if there is any special procedure that I should know of regarding these Chinese copy keys...

Regarding the "few locksmiths said they couldn’t cut it..." I'm aware of that because before I ordered the key I called a local locsmiths if they can cut in the key. The guy complained about Chinese copyes can be really hard on the blade damaging the key cutting equipment sometimes but I was told they will sort it out anyway for £15.

 

[pat100]

I used this site for my blade:

KEY TO YOUR CAR | eBay Stores

WELCOME IN MY SHOP. I HAVE ON OFFER KEYS TO MOST MAKES AND MODELS FROM ABOUT 1998 TILL NOW. IF YOU CAN'T FIND WHAT YOU NEED OR NOT SURE WHICH KEY WILL FIT YOUR CAR PLEASE SEND ME MESSAGE AND I'LL SEE HOW CAN HELP. ALL KEYS LISTED AS REFURBISHED ARE RENEW BY ME USING GOOD QUALITY PARTS AND DOUBLE...

www.ebay.co.uk

 

[sazbaztaz]

Ok so here I am again thinking that it's me doing something wrong in the process of programming.

Firts of all if somebody could help me clarify some things it would be much easyer. After watching couple of youtube videos something just does not add up to me.

When you program a NEW key to a vehicle do you HAVE TO go trough the OLD key again when the software asks you "Would you like to add another key?"

If yes, then I'd have another question...

In normal case, when you know your new/blank key chip is definitely not dull and working and the key programmer software and unit is definitely working, what would happen if I'd select NO and finish the programming? Will the OLD key still work or just the NEW key or BOTH or NONE?

When I see videos of key programming people alsmost always "run trough" the old key as well.

 

[valer]

When you program a NEW key to a vehicle do you HAVE TO go trough the OLD key again when the software asks you "Would you like to add another key?"

No you don't HAVE TO but if you don't you will only have the single key that will work,the old ones will stay erased,
If you want to use a new key plus any old ones it needs to be done in the one programming operation

 

[pat100]

AFAIK adding a key to the car’s system will wipe the car’s record of all previous keys. So, you have to program in all keys that you want to use in one single session. Any key that you don’t include will no longer be recognised.

 

[sazbaztaz]

AFAIK adding a key to the car’s system will wipe the car’s record of all previous keys...

Ok, let's say I have two programmed keys which work fine.

When I scan with the OBD software and tap on "Read Number of Programmed Keys" (the text might differ from brand to brand) it says 2.

Now, I go ahead and go to Key Pro Programming ---> Add Keys

I go trough all the required steps for adding keys with ONLY ONE key.

Then in theory, provided everything works as it's supposed to the following should happen:
1. My second key which was working previously will NOT work anymore
2. If go agin and tap on "Read Number of Programmed Keys" again, it should say 1

The reason I ask the above is the following...

If I go now and tap on "Read Number of Programmed Keys" it says 2 but my car was hended to me by the dealer with ONE key only.

Provided my above assumptions are true, I could find out if the problem is with the NEW key from Ebay or the OBD key programmer.

If I would go trough the programming process with my WORKING key only and at the end tapping again on "Read Number of Programmed Keys" would say 1 instead of 2 previously I would know it's the new key from Ebay either faulty or not compatible. The other way aroud it would be the OBD...

Btw I contacted the dealer from Alibaba I got my XTool D7 from. I was told to take a video of the process and send them back which I did. If someone is interested here it is...

Also, up-close pictures of the original keys board and the chinese aftermarket where chip numbers are clearly visible.

 

[sazbaztaz]

Ok so...

I've ordered this key from EBay...
VAUXHALL REMOTE KEY FOB. GENUINE CIRCUIT BOARD. CORSA E. ASTRA J. INSIGNIA. | eBay

According to the seller this is a genuine curcuit board enclosed in aftermarket chinese casing.

I don't know if it's true or not but I managed to program the key to my wehicle first attempt!

And btw, when asked "Weater to program the next key?" when the new key finished programming I selected "No" and DID NOT go trough with my old key as well and... my old key still works!

Watching videos on youtube they always say you need to do this in order for your old key to work but apparently this is not needed. Maybe with other vehicle types...

Now a question...

I I'd go with "All Keys Lost" instead of "Add Key" (which I did) would I still be able to use my OLD keys which are now programmed to my vehicle?

The reason I ask... no when I click on "Read rumber of keys progammed" it returns "3". Weather somebody still has this third key somewhere I don't know and I'd like to remove this third key...

 

[valer]

If your old key still works and it still shows 3 keys programmed then It sounds much more likely that your programmer doesn't do the full key erase that the Vx SPS and opcom do rather than anything else.
This full erase method is specifically there to wipe off any keys the previous owner may have and is standard on all the later GM built Vauxhalls from about 2009.

 

[sazbaztaz]

If your old key still works and it still shows 3 keys programmed then It sounds much more likely that your programmer doesn't do the full key erase...

I see...

So, what's the difference between selecting "All Keys Lost" and "Add Key" then?

I assume Opcom has these two functions as well and if both fully erase the keys theorectically there's no difference is there?

 

[valer]

I see...

So, what's the difference between selecting "All Keys Lost" and "Add Key" then?

I assume Opcom has these two functions as well and if both fully erase the keys theorectically there's no difference is there?

You assume incorrectly,the opcom version i've used just has "program transponder keys"
select it then after a short while you get a screen saying all keys have been erased and would you like to add a new key ? click yes,it does it's stuff then asks would you like to add another key and so on until all the keys you need are programmed

 

[sazbaztaz]

You assume incorrectly,the opcom version i've used just has "program transponder keys"...

I see so it makes sence then!

On my XTool D7 when I go to "Special Function" ---> "Key Programming" ---> "Vauxhall/Opel" ---> "Immobilizer" ---> "Select From Vehicle Type" ---> "Astra J", there are four options...

All Keys Lost, Add Key, Read Security Pin, and Turn on Immobiliser Light (or something like that)

I guess it's just the way XTool prorammed the software. If you do not select All Keys Lost it will not erase the previous keys which in my opinion makes sence actually.

Anyway thanks for the info...